I’m still waiting for clarification regarding how helping elect Trump, who will actively work against virtually any position the Green Party has ever supported, furthers the the Green Party’s goals. It might be plausible to say they are trying to capture enough of the vote to qualify for federal election funding next cycle, but no party leader seems to be actually saying that consistently. So, seems a lot like they just want to watch the world burn.
BTW, Kshama Sawant is a con artist. She was my Seattle city council rep. Multiple ethics complaints during her tenure. She pledged to donate her city council salary ($117k) above the city average income ($40k), then didn’t. Wouldn’t engage with any constituents who weren’t sycophants. Subject to the first recall effort since 1975. If she’s involved, safe bet it’s a scam.
I’m not sure that I agree that Harris is refusing to change policies wrt Israel. The problem is the sitting administration. She cannot speak against it at this time. I’m not saying I agree with the Biden approach. I find it appalling. I also think his approaches have been very backwards if anything. Too little for Ukraine and too much for Israel and am deeply wtf at that. It is the one huge black mark on the Biden administration, a shame considering it is otherwise one of the finest we have ever had.
yeah, we don't really know what she's going to do yet. she's refused to promise much of anything, though, and has said she's continue arms sales no matter what...so I think there's reason to be pessimistic.
I'm willing to wait and see on the whole "arms sales to Israel"—because I think Netanyahu's gone so far off the deep end that he's making America's continued support look like a bigger mistake with every passing day.
Thank you for putting all this into words. It's been a frustrating election cycle with this especially. like please tell me, fellow far leftists, how it would help Gaza to have Trump elected 🙄 sigh
Why are people so fucking weird? Willing to throw everything they say they care about away so they can have revenge? It’s bizarre. I’m completely disgusted by America’s involvement in the genocide in Gaza and now Lebanon, but I’m awake enough to know that a Trump presidency will mean more death and torture of marginalized people, and more horror everywhere. We need to give Kamala a chance to do better than Biden. She can’t do worse.
This is depressing. A friend of mine ran for local office on the Green ticket years back. She didn't win, of course (I mean, Missouri) but seeing her party come to this can't be easy.
It sucks. It all sucks. There’s a good reason I’m not president, because I would have told Bibi good luck keeping this scam going without our cooperation. It’s so obvious that he will do anything to avoid ending the fighting because then he has to face the piper at home. But this close to the election, Kamala has to keep any ideas she may have for pressuring Israel close to the vest. I really hope though that if she wins, Kamala makes it clear that she is not going to put up with the bullshit Biden has been, and that the minimum condition for arms sales is compliance with international law.
A political movement can only succeed where it is paired with a values based social program.
Instead, Thirty-one years of abject failure to create a social program while pissing away every kind of capital on futile and destructive national campaigns.
Since ‘93, US Greens effectively abandoned social program and institution building for “electoral politics,”and “The Green Party.” The Naderites (the man himself was reluctant) glommed on, and no good has come of it. Useless.
I agree with what you're saying intellectually, but emotionally, I just can't. I'm so sickened by this genocide. For once I am glad I'm not in a swing state, because I can leave the top of my ballot blank without guilt. If I was in a swing state, I would have a really hard time holding my nose to vote for Harris. She's got nobody but herself and the Party to blame if she loses. She knows damn well that the majority of Democrats want a ceasefire and to stop sending weapons, like yesterday.
It’s good to see the Greens come out of the closet so the entire US branch of the Putin fan club can come together just in time for the final push to Election Day.
I feel like there are thousands of voters that Harris chose to alienate. It's not really fair to blame the voters in Michigan and Georgia who wanted to vote for her but can't without her making some sort of meaningful statement of intent about her plans for dealing with Israel for throwing the election. Everyone is acting like she's lost these votes through some sort of manipulation from the wily scheming Green Party but that's not the case for the vast majority of them. They don't want to vote for Stein, they want to vote for Harris, but they can't vote for someone who refuses to budge on her position. She hasn't been flexible at all, she's barely been civil. So fine, you've convinced me there are no worthwhile candidates anywhere, everyone is a grifter or a sociopath. Fine. I won't vote at all. I'm fucking exhausted by this constant hypocrisy from Democrats refusing to accept their own complicity with a candidate who barely masks her disdain for anyone with the gall to expect Harris to have some really low bar human decency. Fuck it. I fucking quit.
Hi Rachel. I tried to make it clear that I do sympathize with people horrified by the genocide. I am horrified by the genocide! I think Biden's policy is horrible. I hope Harris will do better, and she has made a couple gestures in that direction (picking Walz over Shapiro for example.) But she's also as you say avoided reaching out to those concerned in a public way, which is very disheartening.
I don't want to tell people to despair, and I'd urge people to vote downballot if they don't think they can vote for president. Sometimes there's just no real way to change an issue electorally, unfortunately. But electoral politics aren't everything, and there are still ways to engage—which I suspect you're already doing! (such as...speaking on the issue where you can, donating to people who can help those in Gaza, sometimes attending protests.)
I know it's really bleak. It's a bad time, and there's certainly plenty of reason for despair. I didn't write this to insult alienated voters or to tell people to give up. Just, I think it becomes harder to figure out a path forward if we're not clear eyed about the options. And I don't think Stein (and Green leadership) is worthy of people's trust.
I understand. But frankly I'm tired of voting for the Democratic candidate I didn't pick in the primary to no results generally as far as down ballot voting goes. And that's just in the very local races that a Democrat can regularly win here. I appreciate your efforts to tamp down despair but it's got me. It feels beyond futile when the party expects my support to the point of entitlement just because the other major party is batshit crazy. But ask for something that really isn't as complicated as everyone tries to make it out to be, the Leahy rules and the UN are supposed to be things that we agreed to, not pie in the sky. I can't point this out without my so-called allies jumping down my throat about how I'm just going to hand the election to Trump. It's so fucking insulting and I'm beyond frustrated. Pointing out to me that Trump will be worse isn't telling me anything that I haven't been acutely aware of. What's killing me is that no one really seems to give a shit that we have zero candidates with a chance to win who are willing to call a spade a spade. Especially when a spade happens to be thousands of civilian deaths accomplished with our support. It's disgusting and I can't fake like it doesn't make me feel despair. After all the things in the past 5 years frankly I don't see much decency or integrity in my neighbors.
Electoral politics is always an exercise in disappointment. You kind of just vote to make the absolute worst scenario somewhat less likely.
D support for Israel now is particularly bleak; as you say it’s painful to have people you thought were on your side make excuses for an obvious evil.
I’m going to vote against trump because I am genuinely afraid of what he’ll do to my loved ones and neighbors, even though, yeah, some of my neighbors are supporting ugly things too. I understand ppl have to vote their conscience. I wish I had more hope to offer right at the moment.
My presidential vote never matters anyway and I guess I can finally be glad about that. I have zero faith in our current system of "democracy" where the only candidates who are ultimately successful cater more to any lobbyist than they do their own constituents. I'm not going to break my own heart imagining that somehow my time and resources are appreciated by any political party.
I thought this entire post sounded like Sour Grapes for 2016 to me.
Then I ran into somebody on Quora who must have stepped right out of this piece.
I was as gobsmacked as I was when my former wife and I had dinner with a group of "Rich Snooty Liberals" who carried on just like Bill O'Reilly claimed "liberals" did! It was the most unpleasant evening we'd ever had, and she pled a migraine to get us out of it and back to our hotel room....
Thankfully, I think Kamala Harris has done an excellent job making the case that she deserves our vote—with a LOT of help from Trump being his absolute worst self! 2024 is not going to be 2016 all over again, because Harris doesn't act like she's OWED our votes.
I’m still waiting for clarification regarding how helping elect Trump, who will actively work against virtually any position the Green Party has ever supported, furthers the the Green Party’s goals. It might be plausible to say they are trying to capture enough of the vote to qualify for federal election funding next cycle, but no party leader seems to be actually saying that consistently. So, seems a lot like they just want to watch the world burn.
BTW, Kshama Sawant is a con artist. She was my Seattle city council rep. Multiple ethics complaints during her tenure. She pledged to donate her city council salary ($117k) above the city average income ($40k), then didn’t. Wouldn’t engage with any constituents who weren’t sycophants. Subject to the first recall effort since 1975. If she’s involved, safe bet it’s a scam.
I’m not sure that I agree that Harris is refusing to change policies wrt Israel. The problem is the sitting administration. She cannot speak against it at this time. I’m not saying I agree with the Biden approach. I find it appalling. I also think his approaches have been very backwards if anything. Too little for Ukraine and too much for Israel and am deeply wtf at that. It is the one huge black mark on the Biden administration, a shame considering it is otherwise one of the finest we have ever had.
yeah, we don't really know what she's going to do yet. she's refused to promise much of anything, though, and has said she's continue arms sales no matter what...so I think there's reason to be pessimistic.
Yeah am concerned. Fair. But also deeply aware Trump is vastly super nope. Alas.
I'm willing to wait and see on the whole "arms sales to Israel"—because I think Netanyahu's gone so far off the deep end that he's making America's continued support look like a bigger mistake with every passing day.
Thank you for this. I’ve been feeling like I’m losing my mind, watching this play out amongst folks in my social circle.
Thank you for putting all this into words. It's been a frustrating election cycle with this especially. like please tell me, fellow far leftists, how it would help Gaza to have Trump elected 🙄 sigh
Why are people so fucking weird? Willing to throw everything they say they care about away so they can have revenge? It’s bizarre. I’m completely disgusted by America’s involvement in the genocide in Gaza and now Lebanon, but I’m awake enough to know that a Trump presidency will mean more death and torture of marginalized people, and more horror everywhere. We need to give Kamala a chance to do better than Biden. She can’t do worse.
This is depressing. A friend of mine ran for local office on the Green ticket years back. She didn't win, of course (I mean, Missouri) but seeing her party come to this can't be easy.
It sucks. It all sucks. There’s a good reason I’m not president, because I would have told Bibi good luck keeping this scam going without our cooperation. It’s so obvious that he will do anything to avoid ending the fighting because then he has to face the piper at home. But this close to the election, Kamala has to keep any ideas she may have for pressuring Israel close to the vest. I really hope though that if she wins, Kamala makes it clear that she is not going to put up with the bullshit Biden has been, and that the minimum condition for arms sales is compliance with international law.
I hope so as well, though I don’t know that I have a lot of faith in her on this issue.
Where is the Greens social program?
A political movement can only succeed where it is paired with a values based social program.
Instead, Thirty-one years of abject failure to create a social program while pissing away every kind of capital on futile and destructive national campaigns.
Since ‘93, US Greens effectively abandoned social program and institution building for “electoral politics,”and “The Green Party.” The Naderites (the man himself was reluctant) glommed on, and no good has come of it. Useless.
I agree with what you're saying intellectually, but emotionally, I just can't. I'm so sickened by this genocide. For once I am glad I'm not in a swing state, because I can leave the top of my ballot blank without guilt. If I was in a swing state, I would have a really hard time holding my nose to vote for Harris. She's got nobody but herself and the Party to blame if she loses. She knows damn well that the majority of Democrats want a ceasefire and to stop sending weapons, like yesterday.
It’s good to see the Greens come out of the closet so the entire US branch of the Putin fan club can come together just in time for the final push to Election Day.
I feel like there are thousands of voters that Harris chose to alienate. It's not really fair to blame the voters in Michigan and Georgia who wanted to vote for her but can't without her making some sort of meaningful statement of intent about her plans for dealing with Israel for throwing the election. Everyone is acting like she's lost these votes through some sort of manipulation from the wily scheming Green Party but that's not the case for the vast majority of them. They don't want to vote for Stein, they want to vote for Harris, but they can't vote for someone who refuses to budge on her position. She hasn't been flexible at all, she's barely been civil. So fine, you've convinced me there are no worthwhile candidates anywhere, everyone is a grifter or a sociopath. Fine. I won't vote at all. I'm fucking exhausted by this constant hypocrisy from Democrats refusing to accept their own complicity with a candidate who barely masks her disdain for anyone with the gall to expect Harris to have some really low bar human decency. Fuck it. I fucking quit.
Hi Rachel. I tried to make it clear that I do sympathize with people horrified by the genocide. I am horrified by the genocide! I think Biden's policy is horrible. I hope Harris will do better, and she has made a couple gestures in that direction (picking Walz over Shapiro for example.) But she's also as you say avoided reaching out to those concerned in a public way, which is very disheartening.
I don't want to tell people to despair, and I'd urge people to vote downballot if they don't think they can vote for president. Sometimes there's just no real way to change an issue electorally, unfortunately. But electoral politics aren't everything, and there are still ways to engage—which I suspect you're already doing! (such as...speaking on the issue where you can, donating to people who can help those in Gaza, sometimes attending protests.)
I know it's really bleak. It's a bad time, and there's certainly plenty of reason for despair. I didn't write this to insult alienated voters or to tell people to give up. Just, I think it becomes harder to figure out a path forward if we're not clear eyed about the options. And I don't think Stein (and Green leadership) is worthy of people's trust.
I understand. But frankly I'm tired of voting for the Democratic candidate I didn't pick in the primary to no results generally as far as down ballot voting goes. And that's just in the very local races that a Democrat can regularly win here. I appreciate your efforts to tamp down despair but it's got me. It feels beyond futile when the party expects my support to the point of entitlement just because the other major party is batshit crazy. But ask for something that really isn't as complicated as everyone tries to make it out to be, the Leahy rules and the UN are supposed to be things that we agreed to, not pie in the sky. I can't point this out without my so-called allies jumping down my throat about how I'm just going to hand the election to Trump. It's so fucking insulting and I'm beyond frustrated. Pointing out to me that Trump will be worse isn't telling me anything that I haven't been acutely aware of. What's killing me is that no one really seems to give a shit that we have zero candidates with a chance to win who are willing to call a spade a spade. Especially when a spade happens to be thousands of civilian deaths accomplished with our support. It's disgusting and I can't fake like it doesn't make me feel despair. After all the things in the past 5 years frankly I don't see much decency or integrity in my neighbors.
Electoral politics is always an exercise in disappointment. You kind of just vote to make the absolute worst scenario somewhat less likely.
D support for Israel now is particularly bleak; as you say it’s painful to have people you thought were on your side make excuses for an obvious evil.
I’m going to vote against trump because I am genuinely afraid of what he’ll do to my loved ones and neighbors, even though, yeah, some of my neighbors are supporting ugly things too. I understand ppl have to vote their conscience. I wish I had more hope to offer right at the moment.
My presidential vote never matters anyway and I guess I can finally be glad about that. I have zero faith in our current system of "democracy" where the only candidates who are ultimately successful cater more to any lobbyist than they do their own constituents. I'm not going to break my own heart imagining that somehow my time and resources are appreciated by any political party.
I thought this entire post sounded like Sour Grapes for 2016 to me.
Then I ran into somebody on Quora who must have stepped right out of this piece.
I was as gobsmacked as I was when my former wife and I had dinner with a group of "Rich Snooty Liberals" who carried on just like Bill O'Reilly claimed "liberals" did! It was the most unpleasant evening we'd ever had, and she pled a migraine to get us out of it and back to our hotel room....
Thankfully, I think Kamala Harris has done an excellent job making the case that she deserves our vote—with a LOT of help from Trump being his absolute worst self! 2024 is not going to be 2016 all over again, because Harris doesn't act like she's OWED our votes.
Nor to meaningfully influence an electorate, engaged or disengaged, nor to build a coalition.